2021-12-03 13:19:17	Burzum	Alright im back, have you guys solved the problem yet?
2021-12-03 13:30:11	tyep	World's still on fire, don't think so
2021-12-03 13:31:23	avoidr	Burzum, what problem?
2021-12-03 13:32:18	tyil	https://static.banky.club/shitposter.club/b1dd285f991ac71aa9c6e102da5643138a90e65e5d406cc1cc70a825b8276f88.jpg?name=maga_soy.jpg
2021-12-03 13:32:30	tyil	avoidr: its a winfag trying to be edgy
2021-12-03 13:32:35	tyil	even ullard gave up on him
2021-12-03 13:34:52	avoidr	I know, that's what I meant earlier, tyil. Let me be clueless.
2021-12-03 13:34:58	tyil	ah
2021-12-03 13:35:09	tyil	I'm too autistic for that subtle shit
2021-12-03 13:36:27	avoidr	I don't know, have you seen my '"wew" statement' last night?
2021-12-03 13:36:41	tyil	no
2021-12-03 13:36:45	tyil	I only read high quality posts
2021-12-03 13:36:46	Burzum	I wanted to get an application to run in linux, if people could help me out I would make the switch today avoidr But they laughed at me and told me the solution is to run it through a windows VM.
2021-12-03 13:37:42	avoidr	Dang, that's terrible... who laughed at you?
2021-12-03 13:37:56	avoidr	Someone in here?
2021-12-03 13:38:49	Burzum	Yup
2021-12-03 13:39:49	avoidr	In my #sqt???! I am so disappointed :/
2021-12-03 13:39:52	Burzum	This
2021-12-03 13:39:53	Burzum	https://github.com/OneXDeveloper/MapAssist/tree/develop
2021-12-03 13:39:53	Burzum	and this
2021-12-03 13:39:54	Burzum	https://github.com/OneXDeveloper/d2mapapi
2021-12-03 13:39:54	Burzum	if I can get those working I'm ditching windows for good, only things holding me back.
2021-12-03 13:40:55	avoidr	>D2R MapHack
2021-12-03 13:41:12	Burzum	But it seems that no one in this IRC has the knowledge on how to solve such a problem as this.
2021-12-03 13:41:31	Burzum	So they laugh it off instead.
2021-12-03 13:41:42	avoidr	Low quality bait is low.
2021-12-03 13:41:51	Burzum	How come? It is an actual problem.
2021-12-03 13:42:24	avoidr	What's the problem again?
2021-12-03 13:42:53	Burzum	I compile it and try to run it but no
2021-12-03 13:42:56	avoidr	You mentioned something about installing Linux and this MapHack. How do those relate?
2021-12-03 13:42:58	Burzum	Tried through wine aswell but no.
2021-12-03 13:43:39	Burzum	I can install Linux, I was on Linux for over a month but since some programs never work I end up back on Windows. If we can get this to work then I feel comfortable making the switch and leaving windows for good.
2021-12-03 13:44:22	avoidr	So the problem is you can't leave Windows because your maphack doesn't work?
2021-12-03 13:44:32	Burzum	No because similar small programs like this wont work.
2021-12-03 13:45:20	avoidr	What are those other similar small programs?
2021-12-03 13:45:21	Burzum	I want to feel able to download "any" program from the internet and get it to work in a linux environment like I would have been able to on my windows setup. If that is the case then I'm comfortable in making the switch.
2021-12-03 13:45:49	avoidr	Yeah, but see, this isn't how it goes in "Linux". And never will be.
2021-12-03 13:46:26	Burzum	Then I guess Windows is the operating system for me sadly. I want to be able to change but no.
2021-12-03 13:46:37	avoidr	Why do you want to be able to change?
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2021-12-03 13:47:14	Burzum	Open Source, Privacy, Freedom, Not getting tracked, living my own life without Mr Microsoft knowing everything about it.
2021-12-03 13:47:34	Burzum	 Its not because of cute themes and being "edgy" thats for sure
2021-12-03 13:49:06	avoidr	So there's privacy and freedom and all that stuff on the one hand. And on the other you have a non-working maphack and similar small programs.  You're gonna have to know for yourself which is more valuable to you.
2021-12-03 13:49:13	Burzum	I know a maphack for D2R might seem like a small thing, but it is merely a metaphor for the issue at hand, the best example I could find at the moment.
2021-12-03 13:49:35	Burzum	It could be any program, any program whatsoever, this one is just an example.
2021-12-03 13:49:39	Burzum	But it seems impossible to solve.
2021-12-03 13:50:07	avoidr	Your best example is not a good one. Given what's on "the one hand".
2021-12-03 13:50:08	ampersam	I like diablo Burzum, never played D2
2021-12-03 13:50:38	ampersam	#sqt is very lightly moderated you have to be a massive gaping asshole to get B& so you'll occasionally get dicks.
2021-12-03 13:50:48	tyil	its true
2021-12-03 13:50:52	tyil	ampersam is still around after all
2021-12-03 13:51:07	ampersam	yes.  a shame on all the chanops
2021-12-03 13:51:19	Burzum	That is not a problem, but it seems like instead of confessing that people dont know how to solve my problem instead they laugh it off.
2021-12-03 13:51:29	avoidr	lol
2021-12-03 13:51:31	howoz	yes.
2021-12-03 13:52:03	Burzum	let me change the question to this then
2021-12-03 13:52:05	avoidr	Burzum is a massive gaping asshole if you ask me, but I'm amused.
2021-12-03 13:52:26	Burzum	If I cant run a .exe through wine, what would be some other alternatives to run this .exe file?
2021-12-03 13:52:31	ampersam	Burzum sometimes the only solution is to find a linux-centric tool that does the same job.
2021-12-03 13:52:47	avoidr	Burzum, a VM running Windows.
2021-12-03 13:52:53	ampersam	Burzum a VM.  Wine is afaik the best there is for running .exes in linux.
2021-12-03 13:52:57	howoz	Burzum, port it to linux
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2021-12-03 13:53:21	avoidr	howoz, he would need to port D2 along with it.
2021-12-03 13:53:28	ampersam	Is wine giving you useful error messages?
2021-12-03 13:53:32	Burzum	Things is if I'm gonna have diablo running on a VM 24/7 with worse performance than I would have than by running it natively in Windows I might aswell stay on windows right?
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2021-12-03 13:53:36	Burzum	I
2021-12-03 13:53:36	avoidr	Since his blocker from freedom and privacy is a maphack to D2.
2021-12-03 13:53:47	ampersam	howoz og diablo has a linux port, i'm not sure if D2 does.
2021-12-03 13:53:56	howoz	avoidr, two birds with one stone, sweet
2021-12-03 13:54:00	Burzum	ampersam D2R works greath through lutris.
2021-12-03 13:54:21	Burzum	@ampersam Wine gives no errors it runs the file but it does not show the DirectX rendered overlay ontop of D2R
2021-12-03 13:54:30	avoidr	>@
2021-12-03 13:54:33	Burzum	no error messages, and no errors in hte log of the program.
2021-12-03 13:54:47	avoidr	Not sure if amused or cringe.
2021-12-03 13:55:07	avoidr	But my facial muscles are tired, I better stop.
2021-12-03 13:55:32	Burzum	avoidr I'm sorry about not being as fluent in IRC as you, I just ask for assistance and nothing comes from it. at first everyone was super helpful but as soon as they saw the problem it devolved into degeneracy.
2021-12-03 13:55:42	howoz	Burzum, https://forum.winehq.org/ did you try asking here?
2021-12-03 13:56:34	Burzum	I dont think its a problem with Wine whatsoever, its about d2r being run on Linux produced other memorystrings compared to running on windows, hence the D2R MA cant read the memory the same way as it can on Windows.
2021-12-03 13:56:36	avoidr	Yeah, because your problem is shit and you don't accept advice. People have been very patient with you. But you go on doing child-baits like "hurr they laugh because they are scared to admit they don't really know :DDD".
2021-12-03 13:57:25	Burzum	If the solution on how to get it running on Linux is to run it in Windows I will not accept that as a solution no.
2021-12-03 13:57:40	Burzum	Everyone just using Linux as a frontend to Windows VM's
2021-12-03 13:57:49	Burzum	Everyone seems to be*
2021-12-03 13:58:09	avoidr	If the problem was "how to move away from Windows and use Linux", then you'd accept that as a solution, yes.
2021-12-03 13:58:46	Burzum	It is not moving away from Windows if I have to have a VM with windows in it, and playing D2R with much worse performance than I would have had if I was playing it on Native Windows.
2021-12-03 13:58:55	tyil	you could move away by not cheating in the first place :')
2021-12-03 13:59:03	Burzum	That is not a solution either.
2021-12-03 13:59:08	tyil	it really is
2021-12-03 13:59:19	tyil	>I'm doing dumb shit and it's making me make dumb decisions
2021-12-03 13:59:24	tyil	>"have you tried not doing the dumb shit"
2021-12-03 13:59:25	Burzum	Question: How do i shoot this gun?
2021-12-03 13:59:25	Burzum	Solution: Do not shoot it.
2021-12-03 13:59:28	tyil	>NOOOOOOO I MUST BE DUMB 
2021-12-03 13:59:35	Burzum	Yikes
2021-12-03 13:59:44	tyil	you in a nutshell
2021-12-03 14:00:25	Burzum	Even if its a dumb decision it is a decision of mine. Maybe that makes me dumb. I accept that, but I faced you with a question that noone is able to answer.
2021-12-03 14:00:40	Burzum	Or even care about trying to aid with.
2021-12-03 14:00:51	tyil	it is a decision of you
2021-12-03 14:00:55	tyil	hence we are calling you dumb
2021-12-03 14:01:00	tyil	because it is a dumb decision
2021-12-03 14:01:09	tyil	we have answered it in multiple ways already
2021-12-03 14:01:15	Burzum	if its "i want to run office" you can easily answer "use libreoffice instead" but no, in this case there are no easy solutions so instead of trying to help its "HURR DURR RETARD DUMB DOO DOO HEAD"
2021-12-03 14:01:39	tyil	but since you're absolutely terrified of accepting you've been a retard for years who hates improving his own life if it takes any amount of effort, you don't want to accept the answers
2021-12-03 14:01:43	tyil	that's on you, not anyone else in here
2021-12-03 14:01:55	Burzum	I accept that I'm a retard, should retards not get help with their problems?
2021-12-03 14:02:05	tyil	they should learn how to not be retarded first
2021-12-03 14:02:12	Burzum	Oh boy what a world we would live in.
2021-12-03 14:02:14	tyil	you can't teach a retard anything if he isn't interested in learning
2021-12-03 14:02:18	Wotac	i'll have to adjust that metaphor a little
2021-12-03 14:02:28	Wotac	"how do i shoot this gun?"
2021-12-03 14:02:28	Burzum	Telling people suffering from cerebral palsy to just "act normal and stop being stupid"
2021-12-03 14:02:37	tyil	yes, its not that hard
2021-12-03 14:02:40	Burzum	Iam interested in learning how to solve my problem.
2021-12-03 14:02:43	tyil	humanity has been able to do that for 12000 years
2021-12-03 14:02:47	Burzum	No they havent.
2021-12-03 14:02:52	tyil	what makes you so special that you are the first one who can't?
2021-12-03 14:02:56	Burzum	You are just being ignorant.
2021-12-03 14:03:01	Wotac	"well no one got any instructions so these are all just guesses but this guy managed to get it firing, try doing the same thing"
2021-12-03 14:03:09	tyil	I'm very ignorant of dumb people and their retardedly dumb opinions, yes
2021-12-03 14:03:14	tyil	I'm not trying to be like you
2021-12-03 14:03:28	tyil	I've been like that, and I greatly enjoy not being like you
2021-12-03 14:03:32	Wotac	if the part with "this guy" is missing then there might not even be an answer
2021-12-03 14:03:37	Burzum	Wotac  noone has gotten this gun(program) to fire(work) on linux.
2021-12-03 14:03:59	ampersam	Burzum tyil lives for this
2021-12-03 14:04:14	Burzum	He is free to do so, it makes me no harm whatsoever.
2021-12-03 14:04:19	tyil	Wotac: the response would be more like "this gun shoots yourself in the face, you really jsut shouldn't do that, we're not going to help you shoot yourself in the face"
2021-12-03 14:04:52	Burzum	Not even a reasonable comparison
2021-12-03 14:05:00	Burzum	Hopefully someone will take some time and sit down with me and discuss this problem, someone that isnt a kid.
2021-12-03 14:05:26	Wotac	the most important point here is that if there is a solution it means that someone figured it out and should probably be thanked, if there isn't a solution the blame is obviously on the software maker, not the people who haven't reverse-engineered it yet
2021-12-03 14:06:50	avoidr	Burzum, someone that isn't a kid doesn't have the problem that he can't switch to freedom because he can't cheat in his game.
2021-12-03 14:07:07	Burzum	Wotac Or maybe the blame is on the Linux program itself for not making a compatibility layer to run NT Kernel based software.
2021-12-03 14:07:17	Wotac	it isn't
2021-12-03 14:07:22	Burzum	Should be
2021-12-03 14:08:01	avoidr	>the Linux program is to blame for not making a compatibility layer to run NT Kernel based software.
2021-12-03 14:08:14	ampersam	all 3 of the libraries d2mapapi depends on claim to be portable, have you tried building d2mapapi on linux?
2021-12-03 14:08:27	Burzum	Here we have a road, cars drive on the road
2021-12-03 14:08:27	Burzum	I design a special open source car that needs special roads to function.
2021-12-03 14:08:28	Burzum	I expect everyone making roads to build special roads for me to travel with my open source car.
2021-12-03 14:08:28	Wotac	NT isn't open source that can just be imported to get the support, you have to ask that support from the NT creators
2021-12-03 14:08:53	Burzum	Instead of making my open source car function on the regular roads.
2021-12-03 14:09:26	Burzum	ampersam I built both d2mapapi and d2 MA through vsstudio on linux yes.
2021-12-03 14:09:32	Wotac	more like the road has hidden mines and your close source car has the map to avoid them
2021-12-03 14:09:45	Wotac	but they won't tell it
2021-12-03 14:10:17	avoidr	Burzum, you have it backwards, faggot. Just because you were driving bumper cars in their special arenas all your life, doesn't mean that the real world has to be compatible with your toy.
2021-12-03 14:10:44	ampersam	Burzum but they wont work on diablo2 through wine?
2021-12-03 14:11:21	Burzum	I want to drive a special car that only works on this special road and I beg developers to make my special car run on their already established roads. Instead of just driving the normal car on the roads that already work.
2021-12-03 14:11:57	avoidr	Yeah, why don't you just take the normal car and drive?
2021-12-03 14:11:57	Wotac	standards are normal, just follow standards and everything works
2021-12-03 14:12:20	Burzum	avoidr That is what I have to do it seems like
2021-12-03 14:12:35	avoidr	No, you have it backwards.
2021-12-03 14:12:35	Burzum	ampersam the program compiles and runs but there is no output.
2021-12-03 14:12:37	ampersam	Burzum does the d2mapapi server give you anything when you send it requests?  you can use netcat for this
2021-12-03 14:13:28	Burzum	actually the d2mapapi I can run through a docker and input that url in the config file of D2 MA so that one isnt a necessity
2021-12-03 14:13:41	Burzum	that part seems to function on linux aswell.
2021-12-03 14:14:10	Burzum	It is D2R MapAssist failing to output the overlay onto of d2r, because its not getting any data from the game memory it is trying to read
2021-12-03 14:14:17	Burzum	sort of like they are separated and dont have access to eachother
2021-12-03 14:16:10	Burzum	1. Have diablo running (works)
2021-12-03 14:16:11	Burzum	2. have d2mapapi running (works)
2021-12-03 14:16:11	Burzum	3. Start D2 MapAssist (works)
2021-12-03 14:16:12	Burzum	4. D2 MapAssist should read game data from D2R (map id struct) compare that to the map database of old D2 through the D2 Map Api, suck that map information out of there and display it as an DirectX overlay ontop of the D2R Window.
2021-12-03 14:16:32	Burzum	Step 4 does not work, and its a big step, and I dont know where it is failing because nothing is outputting anything.
2021-12-03 14:18:06	avoidr	I guess that's where you read its code and write some debug lines to see what's going on.
2021-12-03 14:18:33	Burzum	It has a logging function, everything is blank, nothing. so maybe the program isnt even able to execute itself in a linux environment.
2021-12-03 14:18:38	Burzum	not a single line.
2021-12-03 14:19:09	Wotac	well does it have read, write and execute rights
2021-12-03 14:19:16	Burzum	It does.
2021-12-03 14:19:40	Burzum	They all do d2rma/d2mapapi/d2r
2021-12-03 14:20:20	Burzum	It requires a local install of the old d2 files aswell, since that is where d2mapapi is taking its data from, that seems to work, the terminal shows it as running the same way as it does on windows
2021-12-03 14:20:47	Burzum	but it never gets the info from d2rma to "find this information" "load this information" "destroy this information when a new map is loaded" rinse and repeat.
2021-12-03 14:20:53	howoz	override wine's directx dlls with native windows ones
2021-12-03 14:21:07	howoz	it *might* work
2021-12-03 14:22:24	Wotac	btw are you using dxvk
2021-12-03 14:22:47	Burzum	Wotac Tried both.
2021-12-03 14:23:04	Burzum	howoz Where do I find those (both linux location and native windows dll's)
2021-12-03 14:24:02	howoz	there's a dll tab in winecfg(1)
2021-12-03 14:24:35	howoz	download directx from windows' website
2021-12-03 14:24:46	howoz	and do some magic
2021-12-03 14:24:53	ampersam	>not getting any data from the game memory it is trying to read if its looking at the running exe for where the memory should be, but the running exe is having its memory allocations done by a translation layer, wouldn't the running .exe actually have no idea where things are in memory?
2021-12-03 14:25:16	avoidr	Probably this.
2021-12-03 14:25:31	avoidr	Is it actually supposed to work on Linux?
2021-12-03 14:25:32	ampersam	the translation layer would be asking for and getting mallocs.  not the exe right?
2021-12-03 14:26:24	Burzum	ampersam Yes that is What I think is happening. So the application probably has to be rewritten with new memory strings and offsets matching what running d2r on linux puts out.
2021-12-03 14:26:38	Burzum	avoidr It is not supposed to work on linux no.
2021-12-03 14:27:18	avoidr	Then what are you trying?
2021-12-03 14:28:17	Burzum	avoidr To run this program on linux, because I want this program functionality.
2021-12-03 14:28:29	Burzum	And there is no replacement for such a niche thing.
2021-12-03 14:28:44	Wotac	i don't know about these things that much but if dxvk translates directx to vulkan and vulkan runs natively wouldn't it know the location of the memory too
2021-12-03 14:31:12	Burzum	I made a request to the devs to develop a linux version aswell but probably wont happen with such a small team working on a project like this in their freetime.
2021-12-03 14:31:39	Wotac	well the chances of it happening still increased no matter how little
2021-12-03 14:33:31	ampersam	burzum 3 separate programs talking to each other and having to give DRM and anti-cheat the runaround is a clusterfuck, add translation of d3d and windows calls and you made a larger clusterfuck.  I just play linux games and dont really feel like much is missing from my life but if you're a diablo 2 diehard you might want to dual-boot.  
2021-12-03 14:33:52	ampersam	If you're feeling like a chad and diablo 2 map api gives you valid json, you could write a linux tool to query that json
2021-12-03 14:34:04	tyil	>this is still going on
2021-12-03 14:35:02	ampersam	tyil be nice 
2021-12-03 14:35:21	tyil	this is me being nice
2021-12-03 14:35:27	tyil	I could've called you all retarded niggers
2021-12-03 14:35:56	ampersam	i also think cheating at vidya games makes you a retarded nigger but i found it an interesting problem.
2021-12-03 14:36:40	ampersam	tyil now that i'm learning to fuck with python and change how the syntax works, what do you think the nigger keyword should do?
2021-12-03 14:36:56	tyil	>introducing new keywords
2021-12-03 14:37:09	tyil	because python didn't have enough yet that conflict with very common variable names
2021-12-03 15:12:07	kyrio	persist
2021-12-03 15:12:13	kyrio	fight the power
2021-12-03 15:12:24	* 	tyil rows
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2021-12-03 15:43:38	← 	Burzum51 (~Burzum@c83-251-108-82.bredband.tele2.se) has quit (Client Quit)
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2021-12-03 15:44:16	Burzum_At_Home	Hi, did I miss something?
2021-12-03 15:44:34	Burzum_At_Home	I went home, took some devils lettuce and now I'm at the computer
2021-12-03 15:44:55	Burzum_At_Home	you guys have convinced me, what is the absolute best performing program to run a Windows VM in Ubuntu.
2021-12-03 15:45:07	Burzum_At_Home	or Zorin OS or whatver.
2021-12-03 15:51:32	Burzum_At_Home	Nvm screw Zorin OS and their GPL violations and non open source linux project that they demand money for.
2021-12-03 15:51:45	Burzum_At_Home	I will probably go with Ubuntu Budgie
2021-12-03 15:53:16	tyil	libvirt
2021-12-03 15:55:12	Burzum_At_Home	Is it an easy way to setup a win11 VM in libvirt? like step-by-step guide or something along those lines, or are there other easier alternatives?
2021-12-03 15:55:55	kyrio	use debian
2021-12-03 15:57:03	Burzum_At_Home	Alright say I go Debian if thats what you guys are all about, what do I use there to VM a Win11
2021-12-03 15:57:37	tyil	>you guys
2021-12-03 15:57:39	tyil	I feel insulted
2021-12-03 15:57:56	Burzum_At_Home	No not at all, guys is a general term nowadays.
2021-12-03 15:58:03	tyil	ye but I'm not about debian
2021-12-03 15:58:43	kyrio	libvirt
2021-12-03 15:58:50	tyil	either way libvirt exists on debian, and its easier than fiddling with qemu manually for beginners
2021-12-03 15:58:55	Burzum_At_Home	Okay, then what are you about? I want easy to get up and running and just browsing the internet/watching youtube/playing media(mkv videos & Spotify).
2021-12-03 15:59:01	kyrio	also why would you install win11
2021-12-03 15:59:17	tyil	kyrio: he really wants to cheat in a game rather than just learn how the game works
2021-12-03 15:59:38	Burzum_At_Home	To do my work, we need Win 11 at the office sadly, but want to use Linux for everything else and hop into Win11 to do work related stuff.
2021-12-03 15:59:39	tyil	not sure what the point is of a game when you're going out of your way to not improve at it
2021-12-03 15:59:48	kyrio	cheating is good
2021-12-03 15:59:50	kyrio	but why 11
2021-12-03 15:59:59	Burzum_At_Home	Home computer is staying Windows for now due to before talked about reasons, now we are talking about my office PC.
2021-12-03 16:00:18	Burzum_At_Home	so dont consider gaming performance or anything, just general browsing/media.
2021-12-03 16:00:21	kyrio	there's no way a business would say "you must use 11" when it just came out and it's a nightmare
2021-12-03 16:00:23	Burzum_At_Home	and ease of use.
2021-12-03 16:01:05	Burzum_At_Home	Yes, alot of Municipality and State Controlled organizations have switched to windows 11 in their environment and for me to support it fully as a Network Admin I need to be on Win 11 aswell.
2021-12-03 16:01:12	tyil	lmoa
2021-12-03 16:01:17	kyrio	what
2021-12-03 16:01:25	tyil	a lot of municipality and state controlled organisations have switched completely to web apps
2021-12-03 16:01:31	kyrio	is it because the systems admin is retarded and didn't disable windows update
2021-12-03 16:01:39	tyil	they hardly run anything on their local machine
2021-12-03 16:01:43	tyil	and most definitely not win11
2021-12-03 16:02:21	Burzum_At_Home	No, because they wanted to go over to Win 11 and stay up-to-date, everything has been working fine actually. But thats not the point we are getting off track, I have to use win 11 on the VM no discussions.
2021-12-03 16:02:50	tyil	this egotistical attitude is why most people here don't feel like helping you
2021-12-03 16:03:02	Burzum_At_Home	What distro for general browsing/watching youtube/playing media(mkv videos & Spotify)?
2021-12-03 16:03:03	kyrio	it doesn't matter if it's working fine
2021-12-03 16:03:14	kyrio	the ui is garbage and it's even more of a security nightmare
2021-12-03 16:03:23	Burzum_At_Home	@kyrio Agreed. but it is not for me to decide.
2021-12-03 16:03:24	kyrio	security/privacy
2021-12-03 16:04:29	kyrio	just keep using windows
2021-12-03 16:04:48	kyrio	why would you run win11 in a vm on your pc
2021-12-03 16:06:17	Burzum_At_Home	Because Win 11 is running like shit on the work computers, it is a total nightmare and you guys are right it is downright stupid to have made the switch, but here Iam if I'm not on a Win11 it wont let me join the Domain so there are no options I hate it but have grown to accept it.
2021-12-03 16:06:36	kyrio	i see
2021-12-03 16:06:56	kyrio	so why not install win10
2021-12-03 16:07:35	Burzum_At_Home	So I want to do 100% of the things that dont absolutely require Windows 11 from my Linux marchine and hop onto the VM for the rare use cases where that is not the case.
2021-12-03 16:17:46	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home good certs to have if you want to do IT work?
2021-12-03 16:17:55	Wotac	i wouldn't recommend any small no-name distro for a work computer, try debian or kubuntu first
2021-12-03 16:19:24	Burzum_At_Home	ampersam CompTIA Network+ or  CompTIA Whatever+ related to the field you want to work in.
2021-12-03 16:19:30	Wotac	i think it has to be big and supported and stable for a work computer so you don't have to say that you can't work today because xorg broke
2021-12-03 16:19:40	ampersam	swim upstream little salmon, lots of distros are forks of a fork.  Debain, Suse, arch, gentoo come to mind.
2021-12-03 16:20:09	Wotac	debian with KDE is pretty nice, that's what i'm typing from
2021-12-03 16:20:21	ampersam	as being upstream distros that is, I'm a debfag, i like debian, I think its a very professional project which lives up to the "universal operating system" slogan.  It runs anything, it runs on everything.  nice.
2021-12-03 16:21:04	Wotac	remember to use the nonfree ISO if you don't know how to set that manually later
2021-12-03 16:21:08	Burzum_At_Home	@ampersam If i'ts for a Microsoft based workingplace any microsoft based certs should be valuable aswell, same goes for linux based workplaces but linux certs,  if its for say a network job any sort of vendor specific network certs are  valueable aswell, say a CISCO CCENT
2021-12-03 16:21:41	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home nice thanks.  I've heard of compTIA before suppose thats as good a place as any to start.  
2021-12-03 16:22:11	ampersam	also what Wotac said default debian is free software only, some hardware requires non-free stuff.
2021-12-03 16:22:35	ampersam	nvidia gpus and intel wireless cards being the biggest offenders.
2021-12-03 16:23:00	Burzum_At_Home	Alright, so if thinking about Ubuntu or Ubuntu Budgie or Linux Mint or whatever you say its better to go upstream and find the source like Debian and start there and make it your own?
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2021-12-03 16:23:59	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home the reasons to reccomend ubnuntu to noobs shrink as canonical acts more and more like a corporation, and debian isn't as much a nerdy project assuming nerds are using it anymore.  It has a nice netinstall image.
2021-12-03 16:24:08	Wotac	they are all similar enough for it to not matter that much right now
2021-12-03 16:24:33	Wotac	but here's debian nonfree https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/11.1.0+nonfree/amd64/
2021-12-03 16:26:34	Wotac	maybe this https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/11.1.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/
2021-12-03 16:26:39	Burzum_At_Home	Okay, anything I should think about when it comes to hardware? work laptop is using a ryzen 5 3500U and 16 gigs of ram,  does distro matter then?
2021-12-03 16:27:22	Burzum_At_Home	Its a Lenovo Thinkpad something something
2021-12-03 16:27:54	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home thinkpads usually do okay except for non-free firmware for your wireless card.  Is it an intel card?
2021-12-03 16:28:16	Wotac	maybe not intel card if the CPU is AMD
2021-12-03 16:28:20	Burzum_At_Home	Hmm not sure, its a Thinkpad T495
2021-12-03 16:28:21	ampersam	posting from my core 2 32bit T60.  T14 arriving today god bless black friday.
2021-12-03 16:29:05	Burzum_At_Home	It's either Intel or Realtek, since those are the only options for drivers on the T495 website.
2021-12-03 16:30:04	Wotac	the nonfree ISO probably covers that
2021-12-03 16:30:25	ampersam	Realtek RTL8822BE, 802.11ac Dual Band 2x2 Wi-Fi + Bluetooth 4.2, M.2 card•Intel Wireless-AC 9260, 802.11ac Dual Band 2x2 Wi-Fi + Bluetooth 5.1, M.2 card
2021-12-03 16:30:42	ampersam	i've never had realtek wifi, but for intel you'll need firmware-iwlwifi
2021-12-03 16:32:57	Wotac	i believe if the CPU is intel then other parts are more likely to be intel but if the CPU is AMD they don't want to use intel parts 
2021-12-03 16:33:33	Wotac	but i might be wrong 
2021-12-03 16:34:33	ampersam	god i hope i get an intel wifi card with my amd card.
2021-12-03 16:34:36	ampersam	not a realtek fan.
2021-12-03 16:34:40	ampersam	amd cpu*
2021-12-03 16:34:51	ampersam	besides realtek drivers aren't in openBSD
2021-12-03 16:36:00	ampersam	 Dec 3, 8:56 AM
2021-12-03 16:36:02	ampersam	Out For Delivery Today
2021-12-03 16:36:04	ampersam	HYPE
2021-12-03 16:37:19	Wotac	tfw i didn't buy anything from black friday
2021-12-03 16:38:07	ampersam	if you have no reason to don't
2021-12-03 16:38:40	ampersam	i expect to have this machine for years i'm not excited for next years new stuff and intel was having a blowout to get rid of stock for the next gen
2021-12-03 16:39:44	ampersam	12th gen intlel is different and it will be a while until its fully utilized, probably get btfo by 13th when they refine, and AMD is behind on being able to ship zen3 i dont see zen4 being commonly available in consoomer gear for a bit
2021-12-03 16:39:49	Wotac	yeah if T60 can still be used somehow then any current year model will last a long time
2021-12-03 16:39:57	ampersam	>somehow
2021-12-03 16:40:05	ampersam	its not that bad
2021-12-03 16:40:09	ampersam	*copes*
2021-12-03 16:41:07	Wotac	i assume you will notice a speed difference after using the new one
2021-12-03 16:41:19	ampersam	hahaha i'm going from 32bit core 2 to 8c16t zen 3
2021-12-03 16:42:04	ampersam	i can stop leaning on sqt.wtf shell account for building things too which i'm sure ullard will appreciate
2021-12-03 16:42:39	Wotac	everything that happened reasonably fast for it to be usable will probably happen instantly and maybe so fast it's confusing, that happened to me when i upgraded my phone
2021-12-03 16:43:12	ampersam	i look forward to using the mainstream web instead of just lite nerdy unix-world sites
2021-12-03 16:43:23	ampersam	what is it with unixfags and obsession with lightweight websites?
2021-12-03 16:43:35	Burzum_At_Home	Alright installing Debian tomorrow on the T495, Anything special I should know about Virtlib going into it?
2021-12-03 16:44:36	ampersam	red-hats libvirt you mean?  Its very nice.  I like virt-manager its the reason i always have gtk even on kde.
2021-12-03 16:44:56	Wotac	i just remembered that i think i had problems installing debian the other day, the newest version didn't install and i had to install the previous one and upgrade
2021-12-03 16:45:03	Wotac	or was it some other distro
2021-12-03 16:45:16	Burzum_At_Home	No idea, the program people recommended me was the libvirt yes.
2021-12-03 16:45:22	Burzum_At_Home	I got  0 idea myself.
2021-12-03 16:45:40	ampersam	found a local professor's tilde page.  The majority of the uni's pages were very flashy javascript things made by presumably web design students showing off.  the professor didn't even have CSS and proudly displayed a "made with Vi" badge.
2021-12-03 16:46:32	Burzum_At_Home	I took a programming course at school in 2010 and we sat there for a year looking at virtual basic.
2021-12-03 16:47:04	Burzum_At_Home	Visual Basic*
2021-12-03 16:47:17	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home: https://blog.sanctum.geek.nz/unix-as-ide-introduction/
2021-12-03 16:47:40	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home: https://blog.sanctum.geek.nz/series/gnu-linux-crypto/
2021-12-03 16:48:19	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home: https://hawkeyemicrosystems.net/files/books/bashquickstart.pdf
2021-12-03 16:49:38	Burzum_At_Home	Does this tell me what VM environment to use on my Debian install tomorrow?
2021-12-03 16:51:26	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home no just general linux resources.  99% of the time with libvirt i just give it the image of the installer .iso and it just werks.
2021-12-03 16:52:06	ampersam	https://archlinux.org/ not a fan of archlinux but they maintain a good wiki.
2021-12-03 16:52:53	ampersam	https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/
2021-12-03 16:53:01	ampersam	debian administrators handbook ^
2021-12-03 16:54:54	Wotac	debian is so ancient that there's a good chance of finding solutions to problems
2021-12-03 16:56:59	ampersam	is it the oldest still-going linux distro?
2021-12-03 16:57:51	Wotac	slackware is a couple of months older or something
2021-12-03 16:58:34	Wotac	but i think debian userbase makes slackware userbase look like nothing
2021-12-03 17:00:18	Burzum_At_Home	Remember using something called Crunchbang on a media laptop back in like 2012-2013, what was that based upon?
2021-12-03 17:01:17	Wotac	https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Linux_Distribution_Timeline_21_10_2021.svg
2021-12-03 17:01:20	Wotac	here are all of them
2021-12-03 17:05:15	Burzum_At_Home	huh interesting, damn the work behind that one.
2021-12-03 17:05:25	Burzum_At_Home	crunchbang debian based
2021-12-03 17:07:07	Wotac	debian takes their role pretty seriously and they vote for every big change they plan to do, to see if the majority of developers want to move to that direction
2021-12-03 17:08:40	Burzum_At_Home	Does that make it more outdated compared to distros like Ubuntu?
2021-12-03 17:11:33	Wotac	debian stable can be outdated but you also won't boot it up one morning and see that it has crashed and damaged itself so it won't even boot anymore, it's very reliable
2021-12-03 17:12:25	leonardus	Burzum_At_Home: I think something called bunsen labs replaced crunchbang
2021-12-03 17:13:26	Wotac	there are backports so you can install newer stuff, then there are outside stuff like flatpak and appimage for newer stuff, then there are two other branches instead of stable if you want the whole system upgraded
2021-12-03 17:13:47	Wotac	stable/testing/unstable
2021-12-03 17:15:44	Wotac	so even if you want newer stuff you're not forced to leave debian
2021-12-03 17:15:59	Itaru	Wotac: Whats the difference between unstable and testing?
2021-12-03 17:16:34	Wotac	things come to testing after they have not caused trouble in unstable for a while
2021-12-03 17:17:50	Itaru	So testing is more for users whereas unstable is for developers?
2021-12-03 17:20:25	Wotac	https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/choosing.en.html
2021-12-03 17:21:11	Wotac	testing should be a little more stable than unstable but they don't have security repo so security issues don't get a shortcut to come quicker
2021-12-03 17:21:31	ampersam	Burzum_At_Home embrace the stable nature, program against libs and modules installed, be happy that they'll be there until the next big release.  Makes python almost usable without venv lel
2021-12-03 17:23:45	ampersam	If you need a program that requires a newer lib, just save yourself the headache of fucking with debian's libs and use /usr/local
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2021-12-03 17:24:04	Wotac	also partition /home to a separate partition so reinstalling the OS won't wipe /home
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2021-12-03 17:27:31	ampersam	good advice.  separate /var and /usr isn't really a big deal IMO unless its a server with multiple discs
2021-12-03 17:31:11	ampersam	wotac never used the cd/dvd install always used netinstall.
2021-12-03 17:31:19	ampersam	does the dvd offer anything i might need?
2021-12-03 17:31:52	Wotac	CD is netinstall, DVD is full stuff
2021-12-03 17:32:19	ampersam	kk
2021-12-03 17:38:35	ampersam	the alternative is fucking realtek
2021-12-03 17:38:42	ampersam	euuuuugh
2021-12-03 17:38:53	ampersam	please be intel fingers crossed i might want to install openbsd as well
2021-12-03 17:39:21	ampersam	anyone here ever scavenged a shipped win10 install for running in a VM later?  Can I even do this?
2021-12-03 17:39:44	ampersam	since it has win10pro i kind of want to save it.  its less jewy than win10home and i might be grateful i have windows later.
2021-12-03 17:43:10	Wotac	i might be wrong but if you make a microsoft account to run the OEM windows i think it gets bound to your account and maybe can be found later if you just log in with the same account
2021-12-03 17:43:51	Itaru	On that topic, what is the least-pozzed windows version? Is it ltsc?
2021-12-03 17:46:35	ampersam	hopefully it comes with a key so i can verify without an online microshit account
2021-12-03 17:47:15	ampersam	some incel on /g/ just asked how programmers are supposed to get girlfriends and some guy said > it was easier in my day when we had women doing jobs like tape librarian.
2021-12-03 17:47:20	ampersam	based greybeard
2021-12-03 17:51:42	Wotac	there's a non-zero chance it might not come with a license sticker but has some chip on the motherboard that stores the key or something
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2021-12-03 17:58:43	royaljelly	do people actually use acme?
2021-12-03 17:58:55	royaljelly	i refuse to believe that people actually use acme
2021-12-03 18:02:32	Itaru	I'm thinking about picking up a Synology 920 to use as a simple NAS and for nextcloud-related things. Is this a good idea? I want to make sure I'm not missing out on a better deal elsewhere or anything.
2021-12-03 18:33:51	ampersam	https://fox8.com/news/can-a-city-declare-itself-a-republic-oroville-california-just-did/
2021-12-03 18:33:57	ampersam	FREEEEEDOOOM
2021-12-03 18:37:03	ampersam	itaru how much are you paying?
2021-12-03 18:38:27	Itaru	ampersam: probably around $550 seeing as that's how much it is on Amazon at the moment
2021-12-03 18:43:52	Wotac	"Our European visitors are important to us."
2021-12-03 18:43:58	Wotac	"This site is currently unavailable to visitors from the European Economic Area while we work to ensure your data is protected in accordance with applicable EU laws."
2021-12-03 18:44:42	ampersam	Itaru idk i'd get a cheap embedded mini-itx board with a similar celeron.  Those usually dont have fast m.2 drive options though
2021-12-03 18:45:09	ampersam	and the case looks decent, sounds okay but those rinky-dink celerons aren't anything special.
2021-12-03 18:45:31	ampersam	if you're not trying to poorfag-optimize it seems decent.
2021-12-03 18:46:28	ampersam	asrock industrial mini-itx boards with soldered on celerons can be had cheap if you want to price a homebuild alternative
2021-12-03 18:48:31	Itaru	Yeah it's certainly not a cost-efficient option, although the M.2 cache seems really nice in the event I end up filling it with HDDs
2021-12-03 18:49:55	Itaru	I'll look into the mini-itx boards though, if it wouldn't be too large I might go with that instead of the Synology
2021-12-03 19:19:16	ampersam	itaru $550 is pretty competitive you might shave some off but there's a time/price tradeoff
2021-12-03 19:46:46	Burzum_At_Home	Who did i talk to earlier today about switching browser in win11?
2021-12-03 19:46:52	Burzum_At_Home	found a better article about it
2021-12-03 19:46:52	Burzum_At_Home	https://www.theverge.com/2021/12/3/22815209/microsoft-windows-11-default-browser-button-changes